Member Avatar for ronnieaka

intro: i'm a 19yr old in 3rd yr doing btech in computer science. i chose to graduate in that coz i was interested in computers and programming,not like other brickheads wanting to do mba after a technical graduation. ok, in the last 2 yrs i've progressed only as much to developing small time summer projects with my friend for my college(yes i did myself and didn't copy and paste as most of u would love to dig it and criticize) like sudoku,notepad, IE that opens up my custom search engine page with modifiable search tags(google cse), and basic program editor in java and snake in java. stuff like that.

the story
lately,i've been getting a little ambitious since now i only have 1.5yrs and am in 6th sem already. watching pirates of the carribean movie was inspiring and a seminar by an ex google employee who created his own site infolona.com stating "its better to be the big guy with exciting work in a small corporation then be a small guy in a big corporation " made me go: i'm thinkin of creating the next big thing,like facebook or something, that would earn me millions and also be interesting and engaging to keep me programming wise ( coz i purely love programming,and don't laugh if u think "oh i also tried that but ended up doing that stuck up in the arse job at that *&&*&##% mnc,so u don't try it buddy, don't waste time")
thing is i'm willing to pursue the dream, and put in the hard work. nights on my thing, day time on college study is what i'll do if need be.
i wanna make some cool web app, or some desktop app, not work for some damn innovation - constipated corporation paying Rs400k/yr. Like Steve Jobs, if i may. be the sorcerer inn the eyes of the generation,make millions.

the Question:
most of my friends advise me to go for open source development: use LAMP (linux,apache,mysql,php) combination if i ever develop a web app, or use OpenGL if developing desktop apps in c++ so that they can run on linux apart from windows only, or use java if ever getting thoughts of .net in my head.
so what is all this hoopla about open source?? when i want to earn money from the stuff i create, in simple terms, can i do it by writing in open source? in other words, if i write some application in open source languages and environments, can i have the developer rights to it and use it commercially for my benefit?(provided i won't obviously use third party add ons)

seeing google and facebook were developed as open source ,i'm thinking of starting to learn about open source environments and languages like linux, OpenGL,php etc

also, is it correct that if i write desktop apps in vc++ or vb or c# or create pages in asp.net which are Microsoft's languages and technologies, then Microsoft is also the owner of that app because the technology used is Microsoft's , and i can't have any rights to it to use it for making money? that there are licensing hurdles especially for developers outside US?


i wanna know all this licensing and open source stuff before i actually set out on practically realizing that million dollar idea coz i figure its better to know where i'm heading legal wise

also advise me what to use for web development (like sites with forums, user accounts, and special pages): LAMP or asp.net with c# or jsp and java
i have experience in java and currently studying advanced java in college
nil in asp.net c# and LAMP

also lastly, please don't hesitate to correct any of my sentences if incorrect, which i posted assuming its correct to my knowledge, for eg, if rightly the a in lamp is ajax, and not apache,correct me.

thanking u all for this long read but be assured u are helping me develop the next big thing

Edited by ronnieaka because: aptness of title
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Member Avatar for Narue

most of my friends advise me to go for open source development: use LAMP (linux,apache,mysql,php) combination if i ever develop a web app, or use OpenGL if developing desktop apps in c++ so that they can run on linux apart from windows only, or use java if ever getting thoughts of .net in my head.

Ignore them. A wise developer uses the best tool for the job; getting political only hurts the quality of software.

if i write some application in open source languages and environments, can i have the developer rights to it and use it commercially for my benefit?(provided i won't obviously use third party add ons)

Open source isn't synonymous with "non-commercial". Each license details it in a different way, but there's generally nothing stopping you from making a profit on the software provided the source remains available and royalty free.

is it correct that if i write desktop apps in vc++ or vb or c# or create pages in asp.net which are Microsoft's languages and technologies, then Microsoft is also the owner of that app because the technology used is Microsoft's , and i can't have any rights to it to use it for making money?

No, that's ridiculous.

Member Avatar for ronnieaka

Ignore them. A wise developer uses the best tool for the job; getting political only hurts the quality of software.

thanks for that. but still in ur opinion, what technologies are best? open source apis and languages or java n microsoft langauges and frameworks(.net)

Open source isn't synonymous with "non-commercial". Each license details it in a different way, but there's generally nothing stopping you from making a profit on the software provided the source remains available and royalty free.

pls do suggest then what type of licensing is available,although it may sound too far fetched since i haven't yet conceived even the idea which i will practically realize.

my intention is to make money from what i do. coz i wanna make money not for the sake of being rich but more than that, like sponsoring other big ideas and help others who won't maybe get opportunities to implement their idea because of lack of financial support. sorry for digressing.
and its still not clear to me, if just by coding using open source APIs and languages,does it automatically make my code "freely ditributable" or does it happen only if i make the code distributable after licensing under GNU GPL?


No, that's ridiculous.

Then is the reason that most people don't use Microsoft technologies for coding that they run on windows only? and still, using microsoft's languages and .net framework really doesn't land ur product in soup? logically i'd believe its their APIs and stuff so they would charge atleast (demand a piece of the pie) something if i commercially distribute an app written on visual C# and/or asp.net(in case of web app)

lastly, thanks for taking out time. i appreciate it. also i assure you miss/mister i would return u the favor of helping me out later in the decade if i get rich. thats a promise

Edited by ronnieaka because: misspelled tag
Member Avatar for Narue

>but still in ur opinion, what technologies are best?
In my opinion, if "best" were so easily determined, there wouldn't be so many options.

>pls do suggest then what type of licensing is available
Google "open source licenses".

and its still not clear to me, if just by coding using open source APIs and languages,does it automatically make my code "freely ditributable" or does it happen only if i make the code distributable after licensing under GNU GPL?

Unless you're using a restrictive library that forces derivatives to be open source, you decide how the code is licensed. However, open source libraries that are used may have provisions that require open distribution of those parts. For example, you might be required to include full source for an open source library that you use along with the binaries of your otherwise closed source application.

Then is the reason that most people don't use Microsoft technologies for coding that they run on windows only?

No, portable code can be written on Windows. The Microsoft hate stems from politics. People don't like Microsoft as a corporation for various reasons, and they project that dislike onto Microsoft products. Sometimes the haters will find legitimate flaws in the products to attack, while at the same time ignoring similar flaws in their preferred alternative. It's both sad and humorous.

logically i'd believe its their APIs and stuff so they would charge atleast (demand a piece of the pie) something if i commercially distribute an app written on visual C# and/or asp.net(in case of web app)

Some licenses are royalty based, which means every time you use it, you pay a fee to the creator. Usually those licenses are service-oriented and consumable, such as image scanning and data transfer. In the case of Visual Studio, you're technically licensing the privilege of using the tool, but Microsoft doesn't claim ownership of applications created with it. I can't imagine a vendor being quite that stupid, because it would have end users up in arms, and the vendor would quickly change or go out of business.

i assure you miss/mister i would return u the favor of helping me out later in the decade if i get rich. thats a promise

I hope you're not insulted if I don't hold my breath. :icon_rolleyes:

Member Avatar for ronnieaka

I hope you're not insulted if I don't hold my breath

well even my parents and relatives don't hold their breaths so no offense taken
they all advise,no, want me to get a mba degree after graduation and get employment in some corporation, as traditionally its considered btech+mba fetches a good job
but now i am a firm believer in this : "if u can create a job, why hunt for it?". hence all this.

Member Avatar for Narue

By all means try, but you strike me as the overly romantic type. Reality can be a harsh teacher, and I'd rather it not turn you off to professional development simply because there's a rather low chance of success at creating the "next big thing".

Member Avatar for ronnieaka

By all means try, but you strike me as the overly romantic type. Reality can be a harsh teacher, and I'd rather it not turn you off to professional development simply because there's a rather low chance of success at creating the "next big thing".

haha i don't see what u see romantic in that. As for reality, well the first two years of college were nothing but harsh. learnt my lesson back then, and now am recuperating with a plan.

and i will tell u one thing surely, the next big thing will come. persistence and skill will get me there, besides backup of my same minded friends

Edited by ronnieaka because: spelling misake
Member Avatar for absolute_zero

Software should be freely usable,redistrubutable and editable to suit the user's needs; that's what GNU and FSF advocate. Developers around the world(including myself) share this view. Suppose you develop a piece of software that you make freely available to the public(by free i mean the whole thing;software itself,source code,documentation). Anyone can tamper with your code and get it redistributed. But you would not want someone modifying your base code and using that to get money out of it. GNU GPL is what protects developers from these sorts of things.

"The big thing" might be a bit difficult to realise unless you've figured out 'exactly' what you want to do. It will really have to be something innovative, and that's pretty difficult to find these days according to me. And things that ARE innovative will demand quite some effort,time and finance. But nevertheless, since you seem really obsessed and motivated, i wish you all the best sincerely ;).

Raising the point of what are the best development tools, there's just one answer: NONE. You choose your tools depending on the type of project you are embarking on, and the audience you are targetting.
I suggest you stay with java, because i think java will make it really big in the future(though it already is really big and omnipresent :P). Machines will get more performant, and the overhead of having a virtual machine will be negligible relative to the need of writing 100% portable software for economic reasons. But that's just a personal opinion.

Edited by absolute_zero because: n/a
Member Avatar for ronnieaka

Suppose you develop a piece of software that you make freely available to the public(by free i mean the whole thing;software itself,source code,documentation). Anyone can tamper with your code and get it redistributed. But you would not want someone modifying your base code and using that to get money out of it. GNU GPL is what protects developers from these sorts of things.

very well explained. thank you. i will post this on my fb wall for my nerd buds to get confusion cleared too ;)

"The big thing" might be a bit difficult to realise unless you've figured out 'exactly' what you want to do.

i don't understand the "unless u have figured out 'exactly' what to do" part. i mean i will develop a web site just like the popular ones nowadays,serving some emotion of people to express themselves, entertain themselves, and enrich their experience of being on web and simultaneously a desktop application.
how more specific do i need to be? now i just need to find some idea that fits in the blanks.

It will really have to be something innovative, and that's pretty difficult to find these days according to me. And things that ARE innovative will demand quite some effort,time and finance. But nevertheless, since you seem really obsessed and motivated, i wish you all the best sincerely ;).

yeah i know innovation is necessary.. its gotta be different, awesome factor should be >4.5 outta 5 to be well ahead of others in buffer capacity for popularity before other catch up( i rate facebook's awesome factor 4.0 and i have my reasons. sometimes, things are stale. and to increase excitement for their own good, they don't incorporate the many ideas i told them in their discussion forums)
and even by my standards i rate myself fairly better then the good on the imagination front. not in the least constipated in that
only thing i don't have in life is a mentor who could answer my questions anytime and guide me through so that i could have made better decisions in programming related choices and saved so much time on researching and learning things all on my own by internet and magazines and torrents from tpb and demonoid. god bless them free ones.
thats also why i end up taking up so much time to get something started. i have to ask on forums about what-ifs and how-tos and whys and why-nots. and then i code. slow process of learning i say.

anyways thanks for your wishes. u seem to have more faith then nurie whom i also thank for her info loaded replies.

I suggest you stay with java, because i think java will make it really big in the future(though it already is really big and omnipresent :P)

i don't see why java is preferred. i don't see many pages in jsp. i don't see many big examples for which big praises of java are sung about. so far, i'vent seen any big site being built on java technology, like facebook or google. they are built on php,perl,c++,python,etc (best to my knowledge,check out facebook.com/engineering and for google, well just google it ;))
only thing i sincerely like about it are its structures(functions,classes and interfaces etc) that have names accurately apt for their functionality, so making them easy to remember and use for GUIs and other coding purposes

Member Avatar for Narue

>i mean i will develop a web site just like the popular ones nowadays
That's not the next big thing, it's parroting the success of others in the hope that you can cash in on the fad. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but keep in mind that it's even harder to kill a popular solution with a new one that does the same thing than it is to find an untapped niche and fill it with great success.

>i don't see why java is preferred.
Everyone has an opinion, and that's precisely what they are: opinions. Though Java is popular both in open source and commercial circles. TIOBE lists these as the top six languages (in terms of most lines of code written) for December 2010: Java, C, C++, PHP, C#, and Python, respectively.

Though TIOBE can be slightly misleading as the more verbose of the popular languages will naturally have more lines of code written. I think that's why C comes before C++ in the list. ;)

Member Avatar for ronnieaka

>i mean i will develop a web site just like the popular ones nowadays
That's not the next big thing, it's parroting the success of others in the hope that you can cash in on the fad.

i did say that i will develop a new thing. "just like the popular ones" what i mean by that is that my site will be as popular as the ones there are now, like twitter,youtube,facebook etc. not exactly a copy of them. ofcourse then the awesome factor would be a meagre 1.0 because obviously people are not fools to switch to such a new thing which is a copy only and way worse looking then the original thing. you don't need to remind me of that. :) i'm here talking about the billion dollar idea, and you are still in loops about some stupid two-penny low-on-innovation idea that will fetch only at most a tenth of a million(take for eg, ibibo.com,copy-sites of orkut.com,youtube like video sites,etc).
to make billions obviously its gotta be something people haven't ever had a taste of.

Edited by ronnieaka because: changes
Member Avatar for Narue

Well, best of luck to you.

Member Avatar for absolute_zero

very well explained. thank you. i will post this on my fb wall for my nerd buds to get confusion cleared too

you could help increase my rep points ;)

Social networks have always been there:myspace,hi5 and i don't know how many more, and facebook came just afterwards. Some would have said that facebook copied those sites(particular hi5), but surprisingly facebook eclipsed them all with its astronomic success that we all know. What made it so successful? I think it's the plus that facebook brought at the time-the ability to let users run applications,develop apps,quizzes and all. Plus the 'like' link under almost everything that you post. These little things all were innovations in their own rights because they were absent in previous websites.
This is the thing you need to find. Also if you are thinking of developing for the web, don't forget mobile users-that is THE future!

Edited by absolute_zero because: n/a
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