are frames good or bad

[Fungus1487]

i am a web designer. i have been asked to create a web app for use on a company intranet. the problem is i have a treeview (those that dont know asp a simple menu structure) on my page which allows the user to pick records they wish to view. all the records have sub records and sub-sub-records etc. the company has so much info that the first level is equating to 3600 nodes already. this totals at a massive 2.6mb file size including the page info. As i understand everytime i post back etc the browser has to re-draw the page. i am not doin anything stupid like recalculating the tree etc but there is a huge amount of lag while i wait for the information to be rendered. Now would using a frameset with two frames left/right be of use.

i.e. left = the tree
right = records data

as i understand this would mean that the tree isnt refreshed just my right frame can someone clarify that this is the method i am looking to implenment to increase performance ?

[autocrat]

Technically, Frames are often considered bad for the internet.... they tend not to be SE Friendly, not particularly good to Screen/Text-Readers either.

That said, if more for a "Web-Application", such as on an Intra-net, then I'm not so sure as to the bad poitns being so important (though accessibility could be an issue!).

I would suggest possibly rethinking things abit.
You need to categorise and segregate into groups to make things faster.
Even if they are all as important as each other, you still need to make them smaller groups, as this will ifact speed up the user looking for things...
instead of showing all records A-Z, try showing A-C, D-F,G-I etc... and let the user go to the relevant group, then get the most likely data.
Much faster

[MidiMagic]

Several books I have indicate that frames are scheduled for future deprecation.

[Fungus1487]

hey, thanks for your help. After undertaking the task and in the end testing both solutions for performance. In all circumstances of EXCESSIVE numbers of records or data i suggest using frames. the increase in speed was at leat 6 - 8 times faster. Taking 20 odd seconds without using frames for me was not an option. I now have the app down to roughly 3 sec startup time with no lag during use while its counterpart was to say the least abismal. This is pushing the barrel as this is the largest number of records ive ever seen anyone use in the software we create, so knowing that it can handle this task is a load off my mind. thanks for the help

[Fungus1487]

oh yes. final note never use ASP.NET treeview or any other type. build your own with javascript. it took longer but load time increased by no word of a lie 20 fold. The server just couldnt handle such a large tree in a decent amount of time.

[Marymead-IT]

You (or others with a similar issue) may also wish to consider making use of the XMLHttpRequest object in your JavaScript. This object is the core component of "AJAX" web applications. AJAX basically allows your application to send and receive data to the server, without reloading the whole page. Gmail and Google Docs use this technology to do things like "autosave" without interrupting the user, or needing to download the entire page to update part of the page.

For your situation, the XMLHttpRequest object is becoming a more commonly used tool unlike frames, which may soon become deprecated.

W3Schools has a nice little tut on AJAX: http://www.w3schools.com/ajax/default.asp

Hope that's useful for someone :),

Chris Fry
- Marymead IT
http://www.marymead.org.au

[nyashaC]

Frames are no good. They continue to be in use because of their simplicity and the unwillingness of webmasters to adopt new solutions(see marymeads post above)
Personally I still use frames but not sitewide anymore i.e my templates do not incude frames but certain individual pages do